08/01/2008 7:20PM

Weekend Stakes, Claiming Crown, etc.


I don't even know if these exist, but it seems a number of posters are planning to play the Claiming Crown on Saturday.  Are there Beyer Pars for any of these races?  I'm guessing not, but if there are, would you mind posting them?
Danny B

Let's take a look at the history of the Claiming Crown:

Iron Horse (1 1/16 Miles):
1999:  A Point Well Made -  82
2000:  Gingerboy - 96
2001:  Secret Squall - 80
2002:  Ruskin - 90 (run at Philly Park)
2003:  Ghoastly Prize - 87
2004:  Superman Can - 88
2005:  My Extolled Honor - 80
2006:  Distinct Vision - 80
2007:  Bargainwiththedevil - 94 (run at one mile at Ellis Park)

Express (six furlongs):
1999:  Pioneer Spirit - 92
2000:  Spit Polish - 82
2001:  The Maccabee - 102
2002:  Talknow - 101 (run at Philly Park)
2003:  Landler - 95
2004:  Chisholm - 91
2005:  Onlynurimagination - 104
2006:  Castello d'Oro - 87
2007:  Golden Hare - 91 (run at Ellis Park)

Glass Slipper (six furlongs):
1999:  You're a Lady - 95 (run at 1 1/16 miles)
2000:  A Lot of Mary - 86 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2001:  French Teacher - 93 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2002:  Won Moro - 83 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs at Philly Park)
2003:  Mum's Gold - 85 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2004:  Banished Lover - 84 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2005:  Ells Editor - 76 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2006:  Funny Woman - 89
2007:  Adore You - 85 (run at Ellis Park)

Rapid Transit (six furlongs):
1999:   Aplomado - 100 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2000:  Teddy Boy - 86 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2001:  Sassy Hound - 100 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2002:  Risen Warrior - 94 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs at Philly Park)
2003:  Pioneer Boy - 102 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2004:  Heroic Sight - 98 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2005:  Procreate - 101 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs)
2006:  Crafty Schemer - 107
2007:  Neverbeendancin' - 85 (run at Ellis Park)

Tiara (1 1/16 miles - turf):
1999:  Taffy - 85 (run at 6 1/2 furlongs on dirt)
2000:  Look to the Day - 86
2001:  No Race
2002:  No Race
2003:  No Race
2004:  No Race
2005:  Inhonorofjohnnie - 80
2006:  Tens Holy Spirit - 84
2007:  Unplugged - 78 (run at Ellis Park)

Emerald (1 1/16 miles - turf):
2000:  P. D. Lucky - 90
2001:  Al's Dearly Bred - 92
2002:  Nowrass - 102 (run at Philly Park)
2003:  Image - 92
2004:  Stage Player - 98
2005:  Mr. Mabee - 96
2006:  Al's Dearly Bred - 86
2007:  One Eyed Joker - 90 (run at Ellis Park)

Jewel (1 1/8 miles):
1999:  One Brick Shy - 101
2000:  B Flat Major - 93
2001:  Sing Because - 90
2002:  Truly A Judge - 106 (run at Philly Park)
2003:  Daunting - 103
2004:  Intelligent Male - 94
2005:  Desert Boom - 103
2006:  Me My Mine - 93
2007:  Miami Sunrise - 91 (run at Ellis Park)


Great call on Double Domino. I have a dime on him to win and he looked much the best all the way even though he was steadied to begin, then pulled by Johnny V, then three wide around the turn and he still won by three. This horse might have something in the future. What did you think of his race?

I think he may have a future as well.  He was a little eager leaving the gate, but showed a great deal of agility to extricate himself from a tight spot entering the turn.  He was then spun three wide around the bend, but kicked it in once more turning for home, and won pretty nicely.  By Stormy Atlantic, it will be interesting to see if Pletcher keeps him on the turf, or gives him a shot on the main track.


Does anyone think there will be a horse under 5 years old entered in this year's Breeder's Cup Marathon?  So far it looks like it will be an old timer's race with Zappa(6) and Evening Attire (7).  Who do you think other potential contenders will be?  I think other than perhaps the Distaff, it is the race I am personally looking forward to the most. 

Delosvientos (6-year-old) and Nite Light (5-year-old) may be strong contenders from the East Coast. 


I just read that Zenyatta weighed out at 1206 pounds yesterday and is 17 hands, that is one big filly, but she doesn't look it at all. I don't remember her half sister Balance being that big.
Vertigineux has a 2006 filly by the name of Treasure Trail by Pulpit. Is she on her way to blue hen status? She has had four daughters (no sons) - Balance, Zenyatta, Treasure Trail and Where's Bailey. Balance is over a million, Zenyatta is at $735K and Where's Bailey is at $116K.
Treasure Trail had been working at Saratoga up until the 16th of June, but no works since.
Does anyone know whether Vertigineux has been bred back to Street Cry?
Steve T

Vertigineux has a Giant's Causeway yearling colt, a Thunder Gulch weanling, and was bred to Bernardini.


Does anyone know anything about Arashi Cat? I can not get any pedigree info on him to come up. He is listed in the AE at DMR sat. with Potts aboard. 

Here ya go:
ARASHI CAT (Fusaichi Pegasus - A Chance of Storm, by Storm Cat)  Arashi Cat is a half brother to Grass World, a Group 3 winner in Japan. Dam is a full sister to multiple Grade 1 winner, November Snow and Grade 3 winner Scatmandu. Fourth dam is Blue Hen (superior female) Blue Denim, whose dam sire was Man O' War. Sire has the Rasmussen Factor, (inbred to a superior female within 5 gen.)  to Almahmoud  through daughters Natalma and Cosmah Blue hens are an indication of class in the pedigree. This colt should have serious speed and be able to carry it past a mile on all surfaces.


Can you post the PPs for Lava Man

Here they are:

Download lava_man.pdf


Can you provide the lifetime pp for one of the all time greats at Saratoga, Fourstardave?
KYL Syndicate

Here are the past performances for a Spa fan favorite:

Download Fourstardave.pdf


With the retirement of Lava Man, and with Evening Attire and Perfect Drift getting up there in age, do you think we will ever see such iron horses again in the modern era. I grew up watching old warriors such as Silver Survivor, Peanut Butter Onit, Solar Splendor, Fourstardave, Cardmania and many others. Even though they were often a cut below the best handicap horses, they were always fan favorites because they gave EVERYTHING they had on the track. These are the type of horses that will fight tooth and nail to win a photo finish for fourth place.  Racing needs these kinds of horses to survive, everyone loves to pull for the underdog.

I think those days are long gone.  The breeding industry has too much influence.  If a colt shows any kind of ability, he will be lured to stud by stallionmasters looking to turn a quick profit.  Any filly that earns "blacktype" (don't get me started about the ridiculous overabundance of stakes races - just look at the Saratoga cards) will be bred, and then sold at auction to an uninformed buyer that is mesmerized by that third-place finish in The Green Monkey Stakes (Restricted, $75,000 Purse, for Non-Winner of a Sweepstakes in 2007 and 2008). 
The occasional gelding like Commentator and Evening Attire will fall through the cracks, but the days of non-gelded horses running at top levels through the age of five is probably over.


Some great selections and comments from our posters over the last few days.  Excellent job!

Have a wonderful weekend!

Take care,


SR Vegas More than 1 year ago
Hi Everyone Ok, I'm going to take a different look at Kent D with Big Brown: (I may be a bit naive, but here goes) A) Kent D rates him off the easy lead he had, follows the pace, realizes he has to work on him down the stretch to get him going, and once BB gets into stride he does lengthen and draws away. B) Kent rides out, realizes Big Brown won this race with his heart & guts, ie: A Champion... and takes his helmet off (Hat) in a gesture to say "My Hat's off to Big Brown" he did this....not me. So, maybe he wasn't showboating. C) His son Jake has Usher Syndrome. He wears two cochlear implants so now he can hear, but this condition is robbing his sight. Kent does a bit performance after the finish line to go down in the books, and on video/TV...so his son may enjoy his Dad's win. ..So what, I will say that in Jake's eyes his Dad is a hero right now...and today, I see nothing wrong with that. D) IEAH & it's connections may do nothing with Kent D...it's up to them. So to speculate a replacement, while entertaining here, is just that. Entertaining. That's it...just a different take on the scenario. ............................ Slew, vicstu, John C (I like the anthropromorphic angle) I like the opinions you took on Kent D & BB, too. ...................... Cayman01 I agree with you regarding Slew. Slew, if you get to Vegas I'll buy you beers just to hear you tell your stories. You are a hoot! ..Oh, how was the day at Santa Rosa with your Mom? ..................... Talking about stories... Uncle Steve, .. is there a Del Mar/Part II with the Grand kids for this year? he-he-he .................. Larryk Thank you for the story on Mananan Mclir..truly something good for a change. SR Vegas
Steve V. More than 1 year ago
A couple spot plays for Mon @ the Spa. Prices won't be much though. R1- 7 Sacred Icon R3- 6 Casey's Tribe R7- 9 With Flying Colors Bruce unleashed a monster filly who he acquired from Peter Blum yesterday that blitzed an alw field. - Elope ran a 105 bs fig, and looks headed for stakes competition very soon, and possible future candidate for the F&M BC Sprint. I have came to the conclusion that even if I don't get the type of info I am looking for to make a heavy bet on a 1st time Levine horse, I should (and you) should do it regardless. He is so potent w/ this angle. I would rather make a large wager on him, when he acquires them through private purchase, or an owner switching to him, even more than one that he has just recently claimed out of a race. Dan, If you have any stats through formulator or whatever, on 1st time Levine acquisitions I would be interested to know (and ROI).
slewofdamascus More than 1 year ago
SVhill, the game you describe is the game I know. Peace Rules made a habit of running horses like coal off their feet. And afterwards, he often had enough left to finish the job. Not always, because remember he faced some of the best who were on top of their games. Speed and Class is very special and should be ridden with that knowledge. In this case, I completely agree that it's unlikely ccp would have even gotten to BB, after BB's great start. I can't tell you how many times I saw peace rules or countless horses ridden by espinoza (or a roberto gonzalez), sprint out of the gate, 22 if necessary, to establish an early advantage. They use the second and third quarters to get their breathers, using the first to display their speed advantage. When Sv or Vic talks about these ideas, it's experience talking, and one ignores it at their own peril, but I would really urge one to consider changing your opinion (broadening it) to include this knowledge. Horseplayerss are notorious for their arrogance and unwillingness to bend, but the best horseplayers do bend when the result is to make their understanding of the game better. His informative post puts the idea of a speed duel into the proper context of a Big Brown or a Hard Spun, a very different context than a mint julep or a da'tara, or a ccp, for that matter. Also, the way the track was playing, speed was not backing up, so the whole thing is truly mind-boggling to me (and always will be, probably). Thanks. -slew
Ray Manley More than 1 year ago
PGM, Jeremy Rose has had his suspension reduced to 3 months. IMO, I believe 30 days would have been the correct punishment.
Tinky More than 1 year ago
Calvin – I pointed those things out because they are true, and I believe that putting the (unfortunately) dirty recent history of U.S. racing in its proper perspective helps to exert pressure towards positive change. As I've stated several times before, I firmly believe that whitewashing what has gone on (with respect to cheating) during the past couple of decades helps to enable those who have cheated, and may choose to cheat in the future. This industry needs a harsh light shined on it, as that is the only likely agent for change. Furthermore, I don't consider pointing out that a particular trainer was cheating at one time to be "beating up" on that trainer. I elaborated to some extent only because you and others were skeptical. If I continued to pound away, post after post, then you could consider it to be a beating. As to your second question, the answer is no. I have no personal issues with any trainer or owner (or horse, for that matter) that I have ever mentioned in this forum.
johnnyz More than 1 year ago
John C. VERY good point! Growing up on, and around two horse farms while it is tough to figure out a horses intelligence level, there is no doubt in my mind that they all have a very good memory. Also agree with several that stated that Big Brown doesn't like Desormeaux. This in my mind is where BB's intelligence really shows as I don't like KD either. I have played all, or most of every card at the Spa since it opened 7/23. He has made so many mistakes I can't recall them all. What I do know is he has cost me some bucks. Just my opion, but I feel the health problems with his son is having an effect on his riding. If it is he needs to go home, and be where I really think his heart is. Svhill, nice post I agree with everything you said. My thoughts are that Big Brown ran about how I thought he or any horse would not running in a competive race for all most 3 months. Look, this is a horse that never ran as a two yr. old, won the Derby in his 4th race, came back and won the Preakness in two weeks. That is a plate full for a horse that was not even on the Derby scene Jan. of this year. I stated this following the Belmont: "Big Brown was just simply not fit enough to win the Belmont". Forget the bad break, the starter on the track, the loose shoe, the rodeo ride he got in the first quarter. Just go to the PP's after the Fla. Derby, and study the few workouts along with the TC races and tell me BB was in shape to win any 12F race, much less the Belmont! As Slew said BB won today because of Class. IMO, showing G-1 class is the first sign of a great horse. With that said I don't know how anyone can attach greatness, average, etc. to any horse that has only ran seven races, and has never faced older competition. I guess time will tell? Slew, was going to pass on some Euro tidbits, but my post is getting long so will tomorrow. Can't close without some thoughts on the upcoming Arlington Million. Einstein will really get a class check here. The Million field is really coming up STRONG! The Euro's are coming, the regally bred Archipenko (Kingmambo), Mount Nelson (Rock Of Gilbraltar), and Spirit One (don't know who his sire is). Archipenko will no doubt be the ML fav. Mount Nelson is no slouch. He finished 5th to Haradasun in the Queens Anne S. @ Royal Ascot this year, and got boxed in really bad in the final 2F. While finishing 5th was only 1L behind the winner. Another positive for Mount Nelson is he will have J Murtaugh on his back, who IMO is hands down the best Jockey in the world! Three others that are confirmed are: Sudan, Out OF Control, and Cosmonaut. Is shaping up to be a classic Million. My Spa P/4 blues continue. Only hit 2/4 today. Wasn't going to play tomorrow, but I think Adriano is a lock single in the 9th. BTW, Mott has Prado aboard, not KD. Not surprising as Prado did ride Adriano in the Derby. The P/4 could pay well as there are two turf sprints in the sequence. Best to all!
Steve T More than 1 year ago
Kuppy, Try this one on, Zenyatta would beat either Big Brown or Curlin - just one bozo's opinion. I really didn't hear anyone say that Big Brown was a great horse. I think the consensus opinion is that he is the best of a bad crop of 3 year olds. I am really not surprised you talk about yourself in the third person, after all you are a legend in your own mind, and us? Well we are all garden variety bozos. Why would you want to hang out with a bunch of clowns? Why not start a site of your own, say like www.kuppyskrap.com? Then you could show the world your superior intellect and not be dragged down with lowlifes like us. Mathieu, Great Joe Pesci routine, but remember Kuppy is a made man... larryk, Do you have the address to send donations? Manan McLir has helped my wallet for several years, now it's time to return the favor. Slew, I tend to agree with you about BB and KD, I think he is a sour horse, and certainly not the horse that ran in the Preakness. I forgot you did the Rip Van Winkle thing this last year - Zenyatta has run on dirt, in the Apple Blossom she destroyed Ginger Punch and company. Speaking of North Beach, there was a submarine bar there, The Horse and Cow (later moved to Vallejo). But that was 1975 so I doubt we met - unless you were at the bus stop waiting to go to elementary school. The only one's allowed in were Hell's Angels and submarine sailors. Cayman, Tyler Baze would have had him out front by about 14 and then turn on cruise control telling BB "do me a favor, wake me up when we cross the finish line". My choice of jockeys for BB would be Rafael Bejarano hands down.
Ray Manley More than 1 year ago
Vicstu, I don't think you understood Kent when he states "that would be suicidal" in talking about taking back in the Haskell. If Kent goes with Coal Play in a win the lead at all costs scenario they are going to be going faster. I think that is what Kent is talking about. He did not want to go 22,44 and change and 109 and change. Jocks get instructions from trainers. Sometimes these instructions go straight out the window when the man says go. Hindsight is always 20/20 but Kent chose to back off what he thought would be a suicidal pace (and not follow the instructions). And he made the right choice because he won the race. On TVG yesterday Chris McCarron was asked about BB's less than spectacular race. McCarron sat for a second and said why does he need to win every race in spectacular fashion? He won the race didn't he? I couldn't agree more. I am not a fan of IEAH and I am not a fan of the Oakland Raiders owner Al Davis. But Davis' famous quote should be noted here, "just win baby". BB and Kent did.
Blue Horseshoe More than 1 year ago
RE: Kent Desormeaux I understand that some people aren't fans of Kent's and I think that it's fair to question many of his rides and tactical decisions at the current Saratoga meet, particularly in the turf races but I just don't get the questioning of the ride on Big Brown earlier today. I thought it was a perfect ride!! Zito again had an entry and played chicken with a speed duel and Kent smartly crossed over and stalked off of a very solid pace for this distance set by Coal Play. It wasn't the same BB that we saw at the KY Derby but he was good enough to get the job done today. Who honestly thinks Kent should have gunned into a speed duel with Coal Play??? Do you think a contested pace battle in say 22.80/46.00/1:09.80 would have been a good idea??? If you do, go back and watch the Jim Dandy from last weekend... How did that work out for Mint Lane and Da Tara??? Not so good, huh...especially for Mint Lane... Zito took his best shot and had the duel ensued, Cool Coal Man would have won the Haskell...
Blue Horseshoe More than 1 year ago
Steve V, I was thinking the same thing when I saw the field size and the Terranova scratch in that baby race! Campo's pretty sharp, I bet he knows... Where are all the babies this year???