01/30/2012 12:25PM

NHC Thoughts

Email

Impressions of last weekend’s 13th annual Daily Racing Form/NTRA National Handicapping Championship at Treasure Island on the great Las Vegas strip:

It just couldn’t have gotten more dramatic at the end of the NHC – actually, yes, it could have, but we’ll talk about that in a second – with the last race in the contest, Saturday’s ninth and final event at Golden Gate, deciding the outcome in a way that would have been too over-the-top for even Hollywood.

Michael Beychok, who was chasing front runner Dave Flanzbaum, took Glorious Dancer in the finale. Flanzbaum told me he saved his final elective bet for this race and took Royalism. Glorious Dancer got up in the very last jump to win by a lip, while Royalism finished fast to be third, beaten less than a length. After hovering around 5-2 for much of the way, Glorious Dancer’s odds drifted up a bit late and she wound up paying $8.20 to win and $3.80 to place (don’t forget, the NHC is a win-place contest). So, Glorious Dancer desperately getting up in the last stride, her odds drifting up just enough late in the betting, and Royalism just running out of real estate, enabled Beychok to nail Flanzbaum by one lonely dollar and take the $1 million first prize. Flanzbaum didn’t exactly walk away empty handed. He took second money of $150,000. Still, Flanzbaum suffered an incredibly tough beat for $850,000, and it was impossible not to feel as bad for him as happy for Beychok. For the record, Flanzbaum showed as much class and dignity in defeat as Beychok showed graciousness in victory, which is to say, a lot.

The one problem I had is it took quite a while even after the official sign was posted at Golden Gate for Beychok to officially be named the NHC winner. There was a raucous celebration at Beychok’s table immediately after Glorious Dancer got up. But a few minutes later when things calmed down a bit, Beychok admitted that while he thought he might have caught Flanzbaum, even he really didn’t know for sure. No one did.

Here’s why: Beyond the rightful accounting of the top few contestants immediately upon conclusion of the contest (there is a thorough accounting later on) there is an NHC policy of not providing updated standings through the final few races of the contest. I understand why some think this is the way to go. Proponents of this philosophy maintain that this prevents the end of the contest from becoming an exercise in dart throwing, where some folks chasing the leader will take nothing but bombers in the hopes of catching lightning in a bottle. But – and this is strictly my opinion – I disagree with this update blackout.

For one, while no one wants to see a contest like the NHC turn on a ridiculous longshot, for that to happen, and thus justify the update blackout, a contestant has to be in striking position, he has to have saved enough elective plays for the end, and he has to be willing to sacrifice a better finishing position and payday. Most importantly, a contestant can take as many 20-1 shots late in the contest as they like, but that doesn’t mean any of them will win or finish second. In fact, the update blackout really doesn’t prevent contestants from “throwing darts” late because players, especially those laying around 12th to 20th, are going to do exactly that, not necessarily in the hopes of winning, but in the hopes of getting a significantly larger piece of the purse. And let’s not forget, this NHC was decided on a low 3-1 shot.

To me, the late update blackout is akin to not knowing if your NFL team needs a touchdown or a field goal to win. And from an aesthetic standpoint, much of the electricity of Saturday’s wild finish was lost in the 25 minutes or so of waiting before Beychok was declared the winner. That is because no one knew for sure where anyone stood through the last four contest races.

Speaking of late the contest, Beychok deserves a lot of credit for being as close to Flanzbaum as he was considering the number of plays each had made. After the last mandatory NHC contest race (Santa Anita’s 8th) and with four optional races to go, Flanzbaum told me he had one elective bet left. After the contest was over, Beychok told me that when there were still five optional races left, he still had four elective bullets to use. In his words, his elective plays late “bombed.” Glorious Dancer was his only winner, and the only other money he collected was $7.40 when Schofield Barracks finished second at Santa Anita.

I admit I wondered of this NHC would lose something being the first to be held in a ballroom instead of a race book, a move necessitated by the fact that the NHC field was 60% larger than it was last year. No race book can hold 480 contestants comfortably. But Treasure Island did a great job. We had the second floor of the facility, and in addition to the main ballroom, there was a smaller ballroom set up for family and friends of contestants, or contestants who just wanted to be in a smaller room. That was an especially nice touch. In the main ballroom, there were a total of 18 huge screen projection televisions along the ceiling line, meaning there wasn’t a bad seat in the house. Tables were set up for eight players each, and worries about contestants being cramped proved unfounded. There were 16 manned windows up in front of the room, all of them contest windows and a good portion also being live betting windows. And a huge plus were the 12 SAM machines dedicated to the contest along a side wall. All of this kept congestion at the windows to a minimum.

If there is one quibble, it is that there was more noise coming from the podium this year than in any previous NHC. Most of the announcements were well intended, providing information that was meant to be helpful. But much of it was redundant stuff that was obvious to anyone looking at a tv screen. And some of it, such as the introduction of people who had no connection to the contest whatsoever, was an intrusion. Contestants are shooting for $1 million. They shouldn’t have a constant din interrupting their concentration. But on the whole, Treasure Island did a fantastic job and deserves a tip of the hat.

SR Vegas 8 months ago
General note I see many posters speculating about, how much, or the structure of the payouts, costs, overhead, etc. FYI, DRF posted an article a few days prior to the contest spelling it all out. Please read it, and I hope it answers your questions, and or complaints. ..in short the last paragraph sums it up: "Official prize money was set after the Last Chance Tournament on Wednesday at Treasure Island with the final five NHC seats up for grabs and 70 percent of those entry fees going to the NHC XIII purse. In addition to the $1 million first-place prize, $150,000 goes to the second-place finisher, $80,000 for third, $50,000 for fourth, and $37,000 for fifth. Prizes are paid to the top 50, with the last cashing spot worth $1,003. There are also daily prizes for the top scores with Friday’s pay scale set at $2,500 for first, $1,500 for second, and $1,000 for third; Saturday’s prizes are $5,000 for first, $3,000 for second, $2,000 for third. The total prizes to be paid out this weekend will be $1,507,003. An additional $125,000 was paid to the top finishers on the NHC Tour and another $174,337 in airfare and hotel rooms for qualifiers at the finals for total payouts of slightly more than $1.8 million" for the complete article : http://www.drf.com/news/handicappers-chase-15-million-prize-money-drfntra-national-handicapping-championship I have posted the same at another DRF blog site, and no one has said anything since. Hope this helps. Once again, MW ...nice job on your recap.
Frank Dambra 8 months ago
I see many comments about the actual take in money the NHC accumulates over the year to purse payouts at the contest. I don't begrudge the NHC for taking a % for the service they provide each year but if Rich is right then the 1.5 million overage that is pocketed seems an inordinate amount to take off the top. With the success and growth of the NHC over the last few years, I believe it might be time for full disclosure so not to cloud everyone's speculation and thoughts. I think if the NHC did this it would keep the contest participants fully informed and reduce the doubts among them. It would also give us some comfort knowing that this information that is provided will also be in sync with the government and IRS on that actual overage because with the money taken in now the IRS would if not already start to regulate that activity. This would also remove the speculation that if the overage was not fully disclosed by the NHC to the IRS then what would stop the IRS from shutting down the contest close to next year because those overage funds were not fully disclosed? I have seen this happen with several poker betting sites in which many players lost money cause it was seized by the IRS because they neglected to report the funds being made and were using players money for their own benefits. I would hate to see this happen here, especially the way this contest has grown over the years. So full transparency made be in order here.
Stringmail 9 months ago
Rich I agree with transparency and there certainly is a question as to where a lot of money ends up. I recognize that there are costs but at the end of the day I think it is important to understand the % of our money that is going to administrative costs as opposed to purses. NHC is not the sole funding arm of NTRA but there is certainly some costs incurred. However, unless I am misinerpreting your comments about the Sunday tourney, you are way off base. The Sunday tourney had 200+ entrants and paid off 100% ;purse prize plus 3 NHC quallys. There was no takeout/rake. It's very unfair to bundle that in your comments. I would encourage all that participate in tourneys to understand the % payout structure so they can determine if it makes sense for them to participate. For me, any tourney such as Sunday's at TI in which there was 100% payout makes it an easy decision. Stringmail
charley w 9 months ago
I have just read all the comments and I would like to add that paying down to the top 50 was to high. That's one reason that second place was so low. Most of the contest players didn't come to Vegas to win a nominal prize of a little over $1000.00 dollars.The BEST handicappers should receive the biggest payoffs.Pay to the top 20 and make it worthwhile to the Best players.Sounds like people want BIGGER PAYOUTS so forget the token prizes. The contest format is fine like it is but after EVERY race there should be a update on the leader board.Yes the bomb won the 1st mandatory and put most of us in a big hole but that's Horse Racing.The daily prizes are low especially day 1.You beat out 481 players and get $2,500.00,it should be more like 15,000.00. People shouldn't gripe about the entry fee's if you can't afford to play don't.The entry fee's pay for the prize money.If they are going to guarantee 1 million to the winner they need our entry fee's to pay for it. You aren't going to please everyone so a little change is ok, but I think they should send out surveys to get everyone's opinion's and let the majority rule.
Rich 9 months ago
Entry fees pay the prize money? Do the math. The NTRA took in entry fees and contingency fees in excess of 3.5 million dollars in 2011. They paid out 2 million. Where'd the other million and a half go? Renting the ball room, paying 3 night stays at convention rates, a $250 travel stipend, two days of catered food, racing forms, and salaries for staff at the event. That equals a million and a half dollars? More like $250,000...tops. Plus, they had another tournament on Sunday with an entry fee of $200 for 300 entrants. That's a cool $60,000. Not every handicapper I saw at the event is shot with diamonds. I consider myself fortunate to be able to afford going to Las Vegas for up to five tournaments a year, and I've knocked down over $50,000 in tournament prize money over the last few years, but I'm also smart enough to notice when I'm being ripped off with a tournament that is more hype than anything else.
C 9 months ago
I'm not sure why there has to be a leaderboard at all. It's a handicapping contest; why should contest-specific strategy come into play? I say keep them in the dark.
Turnbackthealarm 9 months ago
A few random thoughts from a spectator who is friendly with two of the top ten and a top hundred finisher: Re dart throwing and the early longshots: I am sick and tired of the complaints about Freddy the Chap. He was a half to Charitable Man. Twenty-Six participants (I think) had this horse. How is this a dart throw if 5% of the competitors had it? Sounds like sour grapes to me. Re payouts: I think the entire tournament payout structure was too top heavy. Much was made of the drop between first and second. But is was about 90 cents that was the difference between fourth and seventh, along with a $50,000 payout drop. Re the facilities: TI was a more convenient and accomodating facility over Red Rocks. However, it would have been great to have tellers and betting machines in the smaller ballrooms. I hated leaving the small room, sliding and twisting my way to the front of the big ballroom and then hustling back to the "friends and family" room. It took too long, it disturbed the guys in the big room and I failed to place a few bets due to the inconvenience. All in all, it was a great show. However, I sure would have loved to see the acceptance speeches recorded and uploaded to DRF.
Larry Eads 9 months ago
Good story by Watchmaker. ALSO: It was just TOOOO damn hot in that ballroom, and they should have put a 6 foot wide aisle to walk thru, down the middle and side to side. The food was not comparable to years past, and I totally agree with all the mumble jumble coming from the podium, a HUGE distraction.
Frank Dambra 9 months ago
I was at the NHC this past weekend and I totally disagree with this blackout rule the NHC has. When you compete all year to get to this contest with one million dollars on the line any competitor or handicapper should have the opportunity to know their position and what they need to do to win. In all of sports you ALWAYS know the score and what it will take for the competitors to win and I don't see why this contest should be any different. The NHC ideas are ANTIQUATED and should be brought up to speed. There are enough restrictions in the NHC put upon the handicappers with 8 mandatory bets and capped odds. There is absolutely no reason with today's technology that the NHC can't provide a more efficient and exciting venue for this event. There should be updated odds after every race with a complete computer link to the leaderboard throughout the contest. This is the consensus belief of almost all the players I conversed with this weekend. This contest is for the handicappers not for the DRF/NTRA. We make this contest what it has become and it is time that you elevate this contest out of the DARK AGES and into contemporary standards and more compliant with the handicapper. This past weekend I mathematically had no chance to win anything with my last two bullets but I really felt for the other handicappers engaged in that battle at the end and totally in the dark in where they stood. NHC it time to take the BLINKERS OFF and provide a better product
Alan 9 months ago
To avoid confusion as there are two Alan's posting here, I'm once again including my last name in my comment. As one of those so-called "dartboard throwers", I can assure you there is an art and a science to picking longshots. I've now made the NHC in 4 of the last 5 years and have already made it into next year's contest (by finishing in the Top15 in the Tour Top100 Online Challenge last month.) My supposed "dartboard selections" in the NHC on Friday were based on handicapping and determining "playable odds". For example, on Friday my "playable odds" for Freddy the Cap was 12/1 and Melrose Woods was 8/1. These odds were based on Beyer progression, watching video replay of his last race and last workout report for the former selection and pedigree handicapping, workout pattern (weekly 4f-4f-5f-5f-6f-6f-6f for 6.5f race) and last workout report for the latter selection. Should I be punished because the half-sister to Charitable Man went off at 45/1 post-time odds from her 12/1 ML? Just because some horseplayers either don't know how to do it or don't spend the time necessary to do it doesn't mean handicapping longshots is "dartboard throwing"! Keep the caps as is. Alan Levitt
Jesse 9 months ago
Re: Comment from Alan Levitt I agree, leave the caps where they are. There IS an art to picking longshots and it goes way beyond just taking a stab at a horse simply because it happens to be at double digit odds. I kicked myself all day on the first day of the tourney for not having Freddie The Cap as my selection. I watched this horse win at more than 30-1 in New York in similar front-running style two years ago. That race didn't show up in the PPs because it was so long ago. However, the horse had just run 3rd in it's last start which represented a snap-back to form of sorts, he was 3 for 11 at the day's race distance, and he was facing a highly suspect field. Alas, I outsmarted myself. I noticed he is now 10 years old and decided he probably wasn't capable of running back to form of two years ago. So, I missed him, but I salute those guys who took the shot. I played (and bet) several horses in the tournament that were in excess of 20-1. A couple ran 2nd, one ended up 3rd but should have been moved up to 2nd in the Tampa Bay race where the winner veered out at the wire. I just mention this because I didn't consider these picks as "dart board" longshots without a chance. The truth is guys, if you can't spot good overlays and horses that are ready to outrun their odds, you probably will never contend in a tournament with 480+ handicappers who aren't afraid to go for big prices. Best of luck to all.
Bob P. 9 months ago
I don't have too much of a problem with the current format and have all the respect in the world for all winners of the NHC but if I were asked what changes could be made that might boost popularity for the event as well as increase universal appreciation for the accomplishments of the top finishers, I might suggest the following: A) With the increase of participants this year I think the possibility of a 3rd day has to be more seriously considered. Thursday through Saturday, 45 races deciding the outcome rather than 30. Could lead to more consistancy by the top performers from year to year. B) Make Friday the mandatory race day. If it looks like races are going to come off the turf on at any venue on Friday, or a winter storm is looming, then the mandatory races can be moved backward or forward for that one track, whichever seems more promising. C) 3 of the 15 races each day are races that the player can back his strongest opinions with a little more conviction. 2 of those 3 races would be $4 WP bets capped at 9.5/1 and 4.5/1 for win and place respectively. The other of the 3 would be an $8 WP bet capped at 4.25/1 and 1.75/1. So we're keeping $64 the most anyone can make, but giving players several chances to do it with odds that aren't capper odds providing they really love a horses chances. If you love a 15/1 horse then obviously you could use one of the regular plays capped at 20/1 and 10/1. If you love a 7/2 and can't think he can lose then you can designate that horse for the one 4.25/1 ticket and earn points approacing what a capper would yield. At least it would bring in strength of opinion which is one ingredient currently missing. It might also lessen the questioning/criticism by many after some of these events as to whether or not the player really liked the horse or was simply looking at the odds. Strategy would be important. What kind of bullet do you save for the end? It would probably do away with the leaderboard blackout. Might generate even more excitement espescially if everyone knows what kind of plays others have.
Bo Kelly 9 months ago
A three day contest would be one day too long. The format is fine the way it is. I realize it is always a good idea to "tinker" or try to make improvements but in this case the lenght of the tournament is just right. It is hard enough for some of us to get away for 3 days (you obviously have to arrive the day before the contest begins) so if you stretch the contest out to 3 days meaning that the contestants will be away from home for 4 days, I believe you would lose a lot of us who although we love the horses and have a passion for wagering on them, have other family and business responsibilities.
AreYouAlive 9 months ago
I was at the contest and appreciate Mike's recap and the thoughts of my fellow handicappers. Definitely agree that the purse structure was top-heavy, and suggest paying down to at least 75th place. The leader board should be updated immediately after every race, everywhere, if technically feasible for a contest like this. Do not agree with adding a day to the tournament, or more races...it's a grind already. Believe mandatory races should be thrown out...if it's an event to crown "the best handicapper" why are we being forced to look at races we would never wager on in "real life?" Some say mandatory races "evens the playing field" but I think not having them makes it even fairer. The auxiliary room at the TI needed more screens...it was impossible to look up and see all the live tracks with one glance...in some cases only one monitor was showing a particular track, and having the ability to see all of them quickly and easily aids in keeping track...and anyone who's been there knows--sometimes that ain't easy! Thought the NTRA staff was exemplary...there's always room to debate ways to improve the tournament, and I am sure the folks at the NTRA are listening. Finally...we're all caught up with the logistics, the rules, the leader board...if you've ever experienced one of these things, I'm sure you'll agree that no matter what, being with so many colorful and talented handicappers, people who share one passion, makes it all worthwhile.
Perplexed Punter 9 months ago
Some random ideas for future NHCs............... The Racing Post in the UK does a Ten to Follow contest and the result weighting seems about right (extra points for higher priced winners, but not enough to skew the contest. Extra points for higher grade races). Also, a three-day contest where there is a split into sub-groups after two days might be an idea to explore (Top third, middle third and bottom third). That way everyone would have an interest going into the final day.
SR Vegas 9 months ago
Mike ..I enjoyed your NHC videos that you put up. You look good in those bright colored polo shirts too. It was nice saying hello to you at the tournament. I am not a qualifier, and I commend all who were there this weekend. I'm a LV resident who enjoys having my Dan Illman FormBlog friends make it to the NHC here in LV. (this year Alan Levitt, Lenny/aparagon4u and Michael Beychok ) with his big brother Ben. and support them. I thought, as a spectator and suporter, the TI did a fabulous job of accomodating everyone. I am sure they will tweak some things to make it better next year I was in the smaller ballroom, much cooler, and had friends sitting in the Main room come over just to cool off. With all the added Big screens, TVs, Betting machines and technology I wonder with all that IT stuff combined with the 'body heat' of contestants and staff , if it contributed to it being so much warmer. I do like the double Ballroom set up . And the catering services, and the Banquet food was super. ( no more 'rubber chicken' ) The Red Rock Casino was nice the last three years, but would not be able to support a crowd this size. One thing I would like to comment , about 'long shots' and 'throwing darts' .. The top winners that I have the pleasure to know, are really, really, good Handicappers, who qualify time and time again & each year they improve here at the NHC. They come here with a strategy, discipline, have researched and worked out what they want to do before hand and are not throwing darts on NHC days. ...and getting a longer shot, is well, a good thing. I will go as far to say that, to those who have posted here, you are just as dedicated in your approach to this sport and the time and preparation. That you just get here is just awesome. Oh well, enough said :) .."Flanzbaum showed as much class and dignity in defeat as Beychok showed graciousness in victory..." Mike , that sums it up nicely ...Thanks again for your NHC thoughts and observations. I enjoyed them.
Steve Piccolo 9 months ago
Couldn't agree more on the comments regarding making the contest become a dart throwing contest. My suggestion would be to reduce the cap on the "bombs" to $30/$15 for win/place. It will help the true handicapper as the dart throwers won't get as far ahead for a good handicapper to catch up. Also, something needs to be done about prize money. Soon many more will realize how top heavy the final is and become dissatisfied that there its no prize money for the qualifiers. Seems foolish to me to pay $400 or more for the "privilege" of competing against 480 others in a year end contest. Some sort of prize structure needs to be implemented for these qualifiers to keep people interested. Just my humble opinions from one that tried but didn't qualify.
GaryD_EmD 9 months ago
Why I don't get exited about entering I've played the ponies since 1979 and think the format has serious flaws. Picking winners is the name of the game and so is ROI! I would play if the cap was 10-1 max. Award handicappers with picking winners, not guessing away picking bombers in every race. With nearly 500 entrants, one lucky person is going to zig the right way in picking longshots. That same person would be up the track the next week. 20-1 cap is way too high, takes the handicapping and skill out of playing the ponies. Does that make sense? (MW - FYI, you cannot enter the NHC. You must qualify for it by doing well in NHC qualifying tournaments.)
Reg 9 months ago
They have let the contest grow to where it is now too large. Yes it's great to be have 480 qualifiers go to Vegas with a shot to be crowned champ, but the field now is simply too large. It's like having 20 horses in the gate for the Derby and the next year allowing 40. They cap the odds but don't seem to want to cap the size of the event. I've stopped playing NHC contests because the real value of qualifying has been watered down. I'm probably in the minority, but I think what I say makes sense. Have weekly tournaments that involve cash winnings and people will still play. Qualifying tournaments should be reduced to limit the final field to the best, not the most persistent.
Nicholas Briglia 9 months ago
Kind of a shame that there is such a wide disperity between first and second money. Seems like the desire to have top prize at a million doesn't leave a fair amount for second. Something like 800,000/350,000 would be a fairer split. Even if it was a runaway, second place should pay more.
KELSO61 9 months ago
Great Tournament!!....Marvelous 1st time experience....All the excitement that Horse Racing gives us,was inside the TI Ballrooms.......The Hotel really needs to get some Light Bulbs.It was tough to read,in the rooms.
Jamie 9 months ago
I'm not a fan of the structure of the contest. The $2WP is fine, but with no threat of being eliminated, its pretty boring for the most part. That's what makes poker tournaments so much fun. You can get knocked out at any time...and if you're towards the bottom of the leader board, you still have a chance. In handicapping tournaments, if you're towards the bottom...you're done. They should make it so if you're horse doesn't finish 3rd or better, you're out. Kind of a "survivor" tournament. You get 3 mulligans and you can pass a race or 2. That would make it so much more interesting. You'd be alive to win it even if you were in last place. And you would still keep score with the $2WP. This contest needs more drama besides the last couple of races. Poker tournaments do it right....handicapping tournaments, not so much.
compellingsound 9 months ago
Great report on NHC, we get a real flavor of the event, mike again, thx a million for the recap... compellingsound
mike 9 months ago
Mike - A couple of questions - Why have any mandatory races at all? All people are doing is picking impossible horses hoping to get lucky. Whatever 90-100 people get 2 of these bombs in then go back to traditional strategies. What you guys need to do is sit down with some statisical experts and devise a format that would reward player's who have real skills - not just a bunch of stabbers.
Rich 9 months ago
I love the handicapping tournaments held in Las Vegas. I enter every Orleans tournament, Gold Coast Summer Classic, The Wynn Championship, etc. I was in this year's NHC tournament and I won't even attempt to qualify for next year's NHC tourney. Why? Well, quite frankly it is darn expensive to enter NHC qualifiers...increased to $150 this year for the weekly "feeder" contests (with 300 entries per week, that is $45,000 into the coffers each week) and then $400, or more if this entry fee also has been increased , for the monthly tourney. Plus, the NHC registration fee is up to $50 this year from $45 last year. None of the NHC weekly/monthly contests have a monetary prize structure..they just qualify one to compete against 400+ handicappers in Vegas where the winner gets a million bucks and everyone finishing lower than 50th gets stiffed. Just exactly does one get for the $50 registration fee? The parchment certificate was nice, but come on guys...a $50 registration fee for the privilege of paying outrageous entry fees every week? And, with 4000+ handicappers throwing money at the various qualifying contests held every week (Horse Tourneys, Horseplayer's Qualify, Derby Wars, BC Qualify, Twin Spires, etc.), the NHC MUST be raising a lot more money than is paid out in prize money for their one yearly tournament. I don't want to sound cheap, but it cost me over $3000 until I finally qualified for the NHC final last September, and that only qualified me to face off against 480 handicappers in Vegas for the abbreviated prize structure. Sorry, the NHC is a little too mercenary for my taste. I won't be there next year...and I finished in the top 100 this year.
squibb 9 months ago
THE EVENT WAS MUCH BETTER THAN THE RED ROCK. SCREENS WERE CLEAR AND VERY BIG.THE BETTING MACHINES WERE GREAT AND VERY EASY TO USE.PLAYERS WERE KEPT UP TO DATE WITH CHANGES. THE USE OF MACHINES MADE PLAYERS WITH MANY ENTRIES ABLE TO PLACE BETS FOR OTHERS. POSTING HOW MANY BETS A PLAYER HAS LEFT IS GREAT IF YOU ARE BEHIND. NOT GOOD FOR LEADERS.I WOULD LIKE TO SEE TRUE HANDICAPPING WERE YOU PUT YOUR PLAYS IN AND JUST WATCH HOW GOOD YOU ARE. PICKING BETWEEN 2 OR 3 20 -1 SHOTS IS NOT THE WAY TO HANDICAP. PICK THESE LONGSHOTS EARLY IN THE DAY AND YOU PROVED YOU ARE A GREAT PLAYER.
Theo L. Hozer 9 months ago
Michael, lemme ask you something. How is it even remotely possible that the folks responsible for establishing the mandatory betting races DON'T look at the weather report the day before? Anyone with half a brain knew that turf racing at FG on Saturday would be canceled, yet they wound up with a 4-horse field in a key mandatory race. The same thing happened last year. As well, it seems the selection committee goes out of its way to eschew big fields in favor of smaller fields that, on paper, appear more contentious. Another head-scratcher. The beauty of Fri & Sat cards nationwide is that they typically attract full fields, yet for some bizarre reason the committee ignores this advantage every year. To me, it makes no sense. (MW - I am one of the three people who select the mandatory races, and I can tell you that we absolutely take into account weather forecasts. I disagree that "everyone" knew there would be no turf racing Saturday at Fair Grounds. It rained there Thursday night, so we stayed away from turf racing at Fair Grounds Friday, and there was none. The forecast was for clear weather in New Orleans Friday, Friday night, and Saturday, so we picked a turf race from there Saturday. It was indeed clear throughout, and because of that, many were indeed surprised when Fair Grounds took off the turf Saturday. When they did, and our mandatory scratched down to four horses, the decision was made - one you are apparently unaware of - to cancel that mandatory race and instead go with seven mandatories and eight electives on Saturday. When we select mandatories, among the many considerations are geographical fairness, and fitting the races together time wise so that they aren't too close to each other. And as for picking races that appear more contentious on paper, that is precisely the point. It makes much more sense to me to use a nine horse race where it looks like seven horses have a chance to win than a 12 horse race that has eight automatic throwouts.)
robert m 9 months ago
Mike, Your comments were right on the mark, although I have to agree with the bloggers who said you were being too kind in your remarks about the constant and inappropriate babble coming from the podium. But on the subject of the blackout, I couldn't agree more. I was somewhere around the 50th position cutoff line near the end of the contest, but had no idea what I needed to do with my single remaining bullet after the last mandatory. Not going for the million, obviously, but 1K or so would have been better than nothing (which I happened to end up getting). In my view, there is no reason not to post the scores on a regular and frequent basis throughout the entire contest. Clearly it was an unfortunate situation for the ultimate winner and second place finishers. Speaking of which, the huge difference between first and second place, did and does seem unfair, especially in light of this dramatic finish. A more even distribution of the money does seem a good idea. A final thought concerns the calls for more 'growth' of the contest. Although the TI did a great job, I can't imagine how it can handle a larger crowd without increasing the already kind of a mob scene atmosphere there was in the ballroom-plus event this year, with so little room between tables and players and no aisles or spaces to move thru. But, all in all, it was a gigantic improvement over the Red Rock in '08, the only other NHC final I experienced., and I do applaud the TI as well as all the staff who put it all together.
Jerry 9 months ago
A FEW PEOPLE IN THE ROOM WITH THE WINNER SAID IF THEY WERE THE LEADER THEY WOULD HAVE BET A 1000 DOLLARS ON THE 3-1 OR THE NEXT PRICE HORSE TO KNOCK THE PRICE DOWN.I GUESS HIND SIGHT IS 20 20. THEY SAID THIS BEFORE THE RACE AND TWICE AFTER THE RESULTS.
Tom Schafer 9 months ago
Mike: My two cents worth. Had a great time. Can't wait till I qualify again. My minor suggestions are that the lighting could have been a little brighter. If there was room, I would suggest a wider aisle down the middle and a little more room by the self serve machines. Probably not possible with the large number of entries. My suggestion for the tournament format is to either have 20 races each day for two days or 15 races for three days each. I would eliminate mandatory races and make all races optional. I would also lower the caps to 15/1 for win and 8/1 for place. I felt the same way after the first mandatory that it would be hard to catch up. I can't believe that 26 people picked a horse that I gave any chance to win that race. Nonetheless, I had a great time and my suggestions would only make a great event only greater. PS: I also agree with others that the prize pool was top-heavy.
Alan 9 months ago
The SAM machine has features to allow expediting the placing of contest bets. Missing from the machine is a recap of bets. The posting of the leader board is inadequate and not timely. Scoring updates should be posted in real time and, if on paper, in readable size type font. Treasure Island is a good venue for the DRF/NTRA tournament. One gripe with TI is the ridiculous charge of $15 per 15 minutes, plus printing charges in the document room. It should be understood that horse players require printing. Another issue: Oaklawn and Tampa Bay should be made to comply with producing entries 72 hours before contest dates or not be included in the contest. It was a good first time experience. The NTRA, TI and DRF staffs were exceptional.
Jesse 9 months ago
The NHC tournament was well done from a logistical standpoint. The self-betting machines expedited the selection process and I encountered no long lines to speak of in making bets or tourney selections. I was a bit peeved that the contest did not provide overnight entry sheets. I had to go to another hotel sportsbook to find them. Entry sheets were available the morning of the races, but I like to organize my picks the night before. The big screen TVs throughout the ballroom were great...there wasn't a bad seat in the room. A couple things would make the tourney even better in my opinion. Make the tourney a three day event. Eliminate mandatory races for two of the days and make one day an entirely mandatory race day. With eight mandatory races each day, I felt restricted in limiting my optional plays to only seven races per day. Also, going to a three day event, players won't feel like they are eliminated if they have a poor first or second day. At my table, guys were groaning when a "cap" horse won the first mandatory race of the tournament because they felt they had little chance to make up the 64 point head start that one of the 26 handicappers who had Freddie The Cap now had. Finally, with a million dollar event, and with all the money it takes to enter qualifying contests, this tournament should pay down through the top 100. Also, the second place guy loses by $1 and it costs him $850,000? Doesn't seem right.
Jay Trotter 9 months ago
Agree with Chuck 100%...the blackout is ridiculous...even more ridiculous is the logic used for the blackout.....posting the standing would involve more strategy really....the contest format $2WP format is designed for longshot plays from the beginning.... I'd like for someone from the contest to defend the blackout rule - I think it's just laziness on their part! Watchmaker - why don't you do something about the blackout rule - don't you work for drf and this is a drf sponsored contest???? Make it happen.
Kirk 9 months ago
I was in this contest back in 02 and the same argument was going on back then about the blackout, it's crazy that this is still an issue after all of these years? I think everyone in this type of format deserves to know where they are at and if they want to throw darts with longshots, so be it. It happens all the time in Handicapping contest, you think with 480 contestants the guy who won was the best handicapper out of all of them? He was that day but run the same contest with the same people 10 times and you will come up with different winners I bet every time. You have to have alot of luck go your way on that day to win, let's get real. It was his day, that's all. I do agree that over 400 people is to many, I think 200 to 250 would be a better tournament but hey I'm just an everyday horseplayer, what do I know??
Chuck 9 months ago
I can't imagine being involved in tournament of such magnitude and not having the standings be up to the minute at all times. The "longshot stabbing" argument is silly. After all, how many "longshot stabs" did the leaders have to make to be in a position to win?
Rea1Quiet 9 months ago
With Win/Place caps in place, that leads more support to the argument FOR a scoreboard.
Scott Carson 9 months ago
Mike - outstanding assessment of the NHC this year. Treasure Island, DRF, and the NTRA did a magnificent job on all fronts - except the scoreboard updating. If they can just figure out how to do that, the tourney will be nigh close to perfect. Perhaps they can contact NYRA, Kentucky Downs, Monmouth, or any number of tracks that have real-time updating of scores the minute any race is official.
TURFMASTER 9 months ago
Mike, you are being way too kind. The NOISE coming from the podium was not only intrusive but highly INAPPROPRIATE. The jokes regarding the "full monty", "double fisting of beers" and reminding us to make dinner reservations was unbeliveable!! The contestants asked several times for this guy to keep the announcements to a minimum but it seemed to fall on deaf ears. I still hear his Texas Twang in my head at night and I only pray he is not asked to participate next year. Good Luck to all in 2012 qualifying events :)
Horseplayer 9 months ago
MW makes a great point about not updating the leaderboard at the end, but don't forget the leaderboard wasn't really updated during the day anyways. They updated the standings about once an hour, put the top 10 in a powerpoint in the front of the room and then everyone else had to read a fine print sheet posted to a bulletin board. For $1-million in 2012. Amazing.
Johnny Bwell 9 months ago
Imho, the contest should be moved to coincide with Saratoga/Del Mar. I think the racing that time of year is so good. That's all!
Blackseabass 9 months ago
Mike, I agree they should have constant updates. While I wasn't a contestant I was very interested in following the progression of Lil'Chok ,Alan Levitt and Aparagon4u throughout the day while bouncing back and forth from playing on my ADW to DRF for updates. While I've never met these three fine handicappers IRL ,I do feel as if I know them from Formblog. The finish was particularly exciting . I liken it to Zenyatta running down St.Trinians which was the most exciting finish for me personally that I've ever witnessed in 40 yrs of tracking. The Youtube video of Lil' Chok shaking his head no nearing the finish of the last at GG & then the rush to get up on the line was a classic. All the formbloggers are proud of these 3 and very very happy for them . The no updates after the final mandatory makes no sense. Lil' Chok had a $60 & $90 horse the first day and a $37 horse the second day. From reading what he says when he comes by Formblog I can confidently say that he ain't no dart thrower !!! Congrats to these fellas one more time . They made Saturday a Special day instead of just another day of many at the races for me !!
Dave 9 months ago
Mike, Good article. Spot on about the scoring updates I was in 48th at the last update but had no feel what I needed to finish "in the money" without a late update. That being said I agree with you that the ballroom worked well. As Lenny mentioned wi fi was an issue at times, particularly if you were trying to watch any video, but in fairness there was no free wi fi at the Red Rock and in some spots there it was hard to find power outlets so this year at TI was certainly a step forward. Your comment regarding the voluminous announcements is also spot on. The announcements were a running joke at our table from the middle of Day 1 on. My main complainment about the tournament has nothing to do with the venue but rather the distribution of the prize pool. The NTRA backed themselves into a corner with the $1 million dollar guarantee and the distribution was entirely too top heavy in my opinion with nearly 66% of the total going to the winner. Lowering the winners share slightly to $800,000 and distributiing the additional $200,000 to the other pay positions makes a lot of sense in my opinion. First of all the $850,000 gap between first and second is entirely unfair and the $2000 for 20th place down to $1,000 for 50th place gave most players little incentive to play for those positions and every reason to shoot for only bombs on day 2 trying for a top ten finish. I could go on but I won't and regardless I will be playing contests trying to qualify for my fourth straight NHC next January.
railbird pete 9 months ago
Firstly Congrats to Mike.. I have always felt that the NTRA should run this Hdcping Contest like it is in the real world... Everyone start with the same daily bankroll ($100?)....First day $$ (are final) and is added to day 2's total at the end of 2nd day for each player's grand total.. Each day have your mandatory (if need be) and elective (the more allowed the more real) races...Use win-place and no cap...Track results... The current style now is the luck of the longshot player...Pick a 45-1 and put $20-20 on him...Now that's my champ !! Railbird Pete
Stringmail 9 months ago
The venue was very nice but there are some things to build on. Logistics/Facilities: The room temperature was difficult to control, no doubt a result of the number of people in the main ballroom. And I have to agree with Lenny that wireless was spotty at best on Day 1. I resorted to tethering to my phone to use Formulator and others at my table gave up completely. Day 2 was entirely different as perhaps the comically referred to "TI IT" added a few more access points to accommodate the traffic and internet access was much more seamless. Purse Structure: Dare we mention this subject in light of the large award, but the payout structure in an effort to publicize $1M to winner and still provide crumbs to 50th was comical. I can only imagine next year when the purse prize is $1.5M and 2nd is still $150K for the 4th or 5th year in a row. Hopefully, the NTRA will realize the illogic of their purse structure. It really was a win or go home affair. Beards: Kudos to Eric Wing for the funniest line uttered in many events with the reference to Houston's 43rd qualifier but can we really stop the charade of the one entry per person lunacy? While I stumbled in near the end of the standings, my wife finished in the top 20 and she'd have a hard time telling you if Oaklawn was a race track or a morturary but she submitted each pick by herself after close consultation with me which I can't say is the same for another individual seen wandering around with his wife's badge on. Who's kidding who, here. While I agree is was a nice tournament, I've no doubt with one in the books next year's event will be even better (but hopefully not too much bigger :-))
Roger C 9 months ago
Mike, Hats off to Treasure Island for putting on a great tournament. The only problem with the the ballroom was the temperature was hot. The projection TV's we're great and the betting machines made placing your wagers the last minute a non issue. I know there has been some discussion about changing the format for next year. Hopefully it will stay the same the finish was exciting even for someone like myself who wasn't in it at the end. Congratulations to Mike, Dave and Paul Shurman who right in the thick of it for the 2 Million bonus until the end.....RC
dud dew 9 months ago
There's a certain contempt, I've noticed over the years, for what many public handicappers (who make their reps to some degree by number of winners rather than ROI) for those ragamuffin "long-shot" players. Firstly, a long shot is in the eye of the beholder (in other words, it's part of what makes a horse race a race). Secondly, different folks have different standards for what constitutes one. Thirdly, every race, and series of races, requires a distinct overall strategy for gambling success. If, at the end of the day, I have two 10-1 winners, because I judged the risks in line with the potential rewards, and you have three at 5-1, same number of bets, same amount, guess who I think is the better handicapper, and guess who the winner of that particular contest is (assuming this is a straightforward "pick the winner" challenge, no place horses involved). So chalk up another bit of ornery backwards thinking for the industry. Quelle surprise! And get a simpler test for veracity, dammit!!!!!!
Art 9 months ago
Dud Dew you're right on about eliminating the place bet. I also agree with your assessment of what is considered a "long shot", on occasions, although rarely, I find a horse at 15-20 -1 and looks like it has a real shot...and I take it when it happens, and I do not consider that as throwing darts...
wayne gunter 9 months ago
I thought it was a great contest, and very easy to make the selections. I had a great time and it could have been better if I had won a couple of the races that finished second. I had 6 seconds Saturday, but still had a chance to cash with 1 bomber at the end. onehoss
harold moore 9 months ago
do you have a list of the races the top handicaps had for friday. 27th?? great stories about the time in Las Vegas. job well done
Alan 9 months ago
Mike, Thank you/DRF, NTRA and Treasure Island for putting on a great NHC! This was head and shoulders above anything we ever had at Red Rocks! Even the food at the Awards Ceremony was good - do you remember the "chicken surprise" main courses from prior years? I had been begging for internet for 4 years at Red Rocks and to finally have wireless service available this past weekend was wonderful! Kudos also for the self-service ticket machines! They worked flawlessly, with little to no lines, even for the mandatory races. I do agree with Lenny that the internet service was slow. For example, I was only able to watch race replays early in the day, prior to the arrival of most of the contestants. Several at my table (myself included) were suddenly dropped from service and had to log onto the system again. Out of frustration, my neighbor just decided to use his own 3G/4G USB card and bypassed our wireless completely. Although I am no expert, I think it was mostly a bandwidth issue due to the large volume of use by NHC contestants. Besides hopefully increasing internet bandwidth available in the ballroom for next year's contest (and I've already qualified), I have two other suggestions: 1. I received free internet BRIS and Thoro-Graph reports for the contest. DRF, as always, generously provided free paper Racing Forms. However, I had to use/buy 14 Cards from my DRF Formulator subscription in just two contest days. As many of us are now internet horseplayers, I suggest DRF also provides free Formulator Cards for future NHCs. 2. I was competing the year John Conte won on the last mandatory race (which I think also corresponded to the last race in the contest) and the scene at Red Rocks was electric. We all knew what was at stake and everyone also had to play the race. I actually like the gamesmanship of not knowing real-time scores/optional wagers available, but also understand why many others would be upset with the current system. Why not just make the second to last race of the day a mandatory race? It's usually a wide-open SA maiden claimer or claimer affair with large fields for the Super High Five. You then hopefully get updated contest Leaderboard scores quickly posted prior to the last race at Golden Gate. Most of the contest leaders will still likely have one optional race available to use and then let the games begin... Thanks again for providing us NHC contestants with a wonderful, memorable NHC! See you next year! Alan Levitt
Jamie 9 months ago
As an NHC participant, I couldn't agree more with Mike's comments. While the folks at the top of the leader board were shooting for a million $, there were dozens and dozens of others trying to make the board (prize $ was paid out to the top 50). Yet the standings for all the competitors were updated only after each of the 7 mandatory races on Saturday (and not at all during the last 90 minutes or so of the contest). Given the available technology, it would have been easy to post the up-to-date standings (including the number of bets each competitor had left) every 15 minutes or so. It certainly would have enhanced tactical decision-making by those trying to hang on in the stretch as well as those trying to come from behind. The reality is that all the top finishers picked several longshots who won. You have to pick longshots; that's the nature of the tournament. So why deprive the competitors of the information they need to make intelligent decisions? This can be easily rectified next year.
aparagon4u 9 months ago
Mike, My only complaints were the poor wi-fi which was down most of the two days and the lack of a real time leader board. With the bets being made electronically the scores should be available shortly after each race is declared official. This was my first trip (of hopefully many) to the NHC and it was one I will never forget. Lenny Moon (Lenny - In fairness, I had no trouble with the wi fi in either room at any time, and I was constantly online. All nitpicking aside, the NHC is a tremendous and, as you said, memorable event - MW)
meathead01 9 months ago
Mike I would like to congratulate Michael Beychok, Alan Levitt and Lenny Moon all from Dan Ullmans blog for their outstanding finish in the NHC in vegas. we all very proud to be associated with these top handicappers for sure and I think we will see much more from these fine gentleman in the future. CONGRATULATIONS MH01